Right on Tamara,

This is probably the only answer to the conundrum, but what if !!

There are millions of unanswered questions in the world/universe that are still unexplained ?

Like the different layers of the earth ! books and experts tell you what is beneath our feet, yet they have not made a drill big enough to reach the earth's core,? and this is taught in schools ???

Hi Carl,

I think they stopped tryiing when they recorded the sounds...it was like the screams of hell! ...

something like that...http://users.belgacom.net/gc674645/grave/hell.htm

Tamara,

Are you saying they drilled through the cable thread ? now that is from the depths of despair !

hi Carl,

there's hope there then...for a new career!

This piece should test your system

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6ryZAqqedw 

 Unfortunately, can't get the one from the Proms which was played by pianoist Hélène Grimaud....very special...( it is on radio 3 play again)

A while ago, i posted a test to see if anyone associated colour with sound.  This lady does have that form of synethaesia.  I am sure that it is reflected in her playing.  I don't think  I've seen anyone play so intensely or attentively to rest of the orchestra.

Hi Tamara, I tried the colour test and  I've never really assocated music with colours and this was  reflected in my score.

Regards

and mine!....have you heard this lady play though!...I haven't heard a piece of music vary so much ever.... all of the instruments and voices interact continually with varying tempos and pauses.....and I'm not a fan of classical musical music generally.

Having said that nor of opera but the Faust; song on the proms was great fun!

You mean the Hélène Grimaud version?

Regards

Hi Wotslice,

Yes...sorry english language has let me down again...

Hi Chris,

I've listened twice to it now and keep going back so you're probably right.  Bryn Terfyl certainly livens the performances but I thought the conductor was great especially his speech/thoughts about music as he summed up at the end.

Yes, I've now seen it twice as well - the first time in years. Roger Norrington was a good choice.

I saw him conduct the Akadamie Fur Alte Musik in Vienna -very good. 

Hi wotslice, maybe the way we hear is different, now I do associate colour with sound and did the test - result 85%. Could it be possible that different brains associate different aspects of sound. Could it be possible that whilst you are very sensitive to cables, Tamara is sensitive to content and I am sensitive to rooms/reflections etc. It would explain a lot.

John...

PS I have been called many things on this site, now a Troll, Luddite, Mr Angry, DR Evil but all I ever wanted was to understand. 

Hi John,

If I read you right - you have shifted ground on cables then - if you acknowledging that different brains (or I add our ears) may pick up differences in aspects of sound in cables.

Have a good day.

Steve.

Well not quite, what I do acknowledge is that maybe different distortions get picked up by different people, maybe I will accept that cables are not my best whilst room acoustics and anything involving real 'low level' detail is, could that be why I can nearly always pick up on whether an amp is class 'A', 'B', or 'D'

All I'm saying is that maybe different brains/ears pick up on different aspects!!!

Interesting..... John... 

Hi All, 

This could be another good description of a Troll :

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/sociopaths

Hey John, although I may have thought it at times, I refrained from calling you names.

My point has been all along that our ears and brains do not hear and interpret things in the same way and this (to me) simple observation, has always been overlooked in previous discussions as  its always about the CD or the amp or the speakers or the cable. At the end of the day this passion we all have called music, is all about what we hear and what to us as individuals, sounds right and that what may sound right to you isn't necessarily going to sound right to me this must be appreciated despite what technical measurements/specs say. 

Take the sense of taste for instance how come we all dont like the same food ? after we all have a mouth, a nose  anda throat?  yet I vividly remember when first ate liver as I spat it out (I was only 5) as I  found it disgusting  (and still do)  but  my mother and father  (and  many others) love it, so I cannot understand how people can eat the stuff but I appreciate the fact that they like it. Why dont we have all the same taste in colours?  we all have eyes and a brain but  (assuming they are working correctly)  some people feel the need to paint their walls lime or drive purple cars as it looks great to them, but hideous to me.

So coming back to sound yes we all have ears and yes we all have a brain but we do not relate to sound and in particular music in exactly the way  as we will hear and interpret it individually.  How for instance can some people like listening to systems that are "bright"  as to me, that would be torture for more than 15 minutes at reasonable volume levels. 

So if you are coming round to a different way of thinking John then that's fine but as you are perfectly aware, none of this can really be scientifically measured, its all subjective in the same way as I cant stand Rap or Country and Western yet millions do.

Regards

Why thanks wotslice, that is probably the longest and most informative input you've ever made BUT one point you and many others seem to miss is that reproduction is simply that, it is reproducing something from the past, it is not a value statement, it has nothing to do with musical content it is simply reproducing it, an analogy I have used in the past is wine is the music, the glass is the system. now wine can have a million subtle flavours to it the same as food, but cables, glasses, no there are only so many variations and there are not that many.

Imagine for one moment that a system were so completely perfect, note I said imagine, then all musical choices would have no connection to the system, so maybe that would separate the discussion between system and content, I really do believe that this is a confusing area and one that is not clearly defined.

I think we need to clearly define the differences, music (software) and system (hardware) are two completely different aspects so keep the two seperate, one cannot correct the other, a wrong note can not be corrected by a system, distortion cannot be corrected by a good band etc...... John...  

Nearly my longest, but this has always been my personal take on things and I really really hate typing. This is  the only forum that have actively contributed to and as I have other musical interests that's why i dip out from time to time.

I dont disagree with your point about reproduction except that Hi-Fi is all about producing a musical performance - so its purpose is to convey a performance to the listener via the components of a given Hi-Fi system. Of course a system cant  correct notes but it will differ in how the performamce  is conveyed, as will the perception of the performance by the listener. 

I've always maintained that if an individual  cannot tell the difference between a "hi end" system, compared to £100 quids worth (and I have some friends who cant) then he/she should only spend £100, so the general rule is that if the system sounds right to you then that's fine that's your view, but dont expect me to agree with you.

Cheers (an early start this morning)