Cheers Bill. By the way, I was very interested in the 'mains cable' test you did. Have you found mains cables to effect any other equipment or have you never really tried?
Ive just fitted a new 16 braid to my av denon amp (Not exactly HIGH fi) but the bass is monstrous and detail just shines now! I was kinda shocked actually as......haha......its hardly the best connection in the world.
It doesnt actually have an IEC connector!! The lead is built into the casing. So I did my own little wiring job of cutting the cable about 3 inch from the amp end and fitting a male IEC. I read somewhere that it actually makes a difference and by golly IT DOES!!
ANOTHER winner for restriction of mains interference
This unit contains a powerful mains conditioning filter which will reduce or eliminate interference coming through the mains electricity supply and help to enhance the sound and picture quality from your AV equipment. The filters are specifically designed to combat both ''asymmetrical'' as well as ''symmetrical'' interference, both being effectively suppressed by the introduction of high frequency capacitors and a single choke. In addition the unit also incorporates an earth line choke to stop interference through the mains earth line and uses a screened mains cable to eliminate the effects of radiated noise interference.
OK this is the claim lifted straight from Maplin's catalogue, now lets rewrite that in real terms. This unit contains an identical copy of what any decent power supply would have in it, now lets look at the costs, a common mode filter choke about 50p, three transient suppressors at 30p each, a couple of capacitors at less than 10p each and I may add not of X rating for mains suppression.
So a rock bottom cheapo costs say £6 but this unit with a couple of quid in suppression costs £40, need I say more... John...
Indecently the claim of an earth line choke is rather dubious as that is the one and only route to dissipate all this terrible interference. Note also that we are talking interference, clicks and pops, not improving picture quality, or sound stage, a mains filter can never do that, not in a million years.
Rik, you wrote, The lead is built into the casing. So I did my own little wiring job of cutting the cable about 3 inch from the amp end and fitting a male IEC. I read somewhere that it actually makes a difference and by golly IT DOES!!
So have I got this right, you cut off a captive mains lead then introduced a pair of connectors in it and that improved matters, is that what you are saying or is there something I am missing here???
Rik, you wrote, The lead is built into the casing. So I did my own little wiring job of cutting the cable about 3 inch from the amp end and fitting a male IEC. I read somewhere that it actually makes a difference and by golly IT DOES!!
So have I got this right, you cut off a captive mains lead then introduced a pair of connectors in it and that improved matters, is that what you are saying or is there something I am missing here???
So is my understanding right, you introduced a male and female connector into an otherwise perfectly OK mains cable and that actually improved the out come, is that what you claim, oh and you could hear a difference???
I sympathise. Most Japanese amps are built with captive cables as is my HC.
Yes...I normally multiplex a braided cable between either T/T or dvd/cd player. Also multiplex one between phono stage and HC Amp, and a dedicated one for Main Power Amp (used for Stereo).
Stock power cords are used for the speakers HT supply and the 2 Class D subwoofer Monoblocs.
Comparing the effects on a CD player, for example, with a Mains Conditioner in circuit is interesting. The higher the degree of conditioning the less noticeable switching between high and low grade braided cables is. What is significant is that the best cables offer a similarly high level of conditioning but if you have a really top notch conditioner the difference between those 2 grades of cable will be less audible.
But...like the man says...there's no such thing as too much purification.....
Best regards...................................Bill.
So is my understanding right, you introduced a male and female connector into an otherwise perfectly OK mains cable and that actually improved the out come, is that what you claim, oh and you could hear a difference???
Yes John. Thats EXACTLY what im saying. And why? Well I made sure everything was clean (obviously) I used silver plated connectors and silver soldered (high grade) where needed. I then sprayed with DEOXIT to try and prevent any oxidisation from the ORIGINAL mains lead. Now 'possibly' all this may have add a deteriorating effect on the sound.
BUT
I then added a braided 16 core solid silver mains cable to the equation and run for a few days (Silver is horrible to begin with). Today it 'blew me away'. So the positive completely outstripped ANY negative effects it may have had and was therefore 'worth it'
I sympathise. Most Japanese amps are built with captive cables as is my HC.
Yes...I normally multiplex a braided cable between either T/T or dvd/cd player. Also multiplex one between phono stage and HC Amp, and a dedicated one for Main Power Amp (used for Stereo).
Stock power cords are used for the speakers HT supply and the 2 Class D subwoofer Monoblocs.
Comparing the effects on a CD player, for example, with a Mains Conditioner in circuit is interesting. The higher the degree of conditioning the less noticeable switching between high and low grade braided cables is. What is significant is that the best cables offer a similarly high level of conditioning but if you have a really top notch conditioner the difference between those 2 grades of cable will be less audible.
But...like the man says...there's no such thing as too much purification.....
Best regards...................................Bill.
I must admit ive never really tested my cd player out. Just connected with a 5 core silver plated mains cable and left it at that (for now )
The point about conditioning is certainly an interesting one. Makes sense if its already filtered then the cables wont make as big a difference.
What I DID find interesting whilst browsing the net was some guys were testing a normal usb cable against a 'kimber' one. Now kimber im a big believer of and in this case the usb cable had ferrites either end. They 'claimed' it wasnt as good as the 'run of the mill' one. BUT ~ they then cut the ferrites off the kimber cable and claimed it was better than the standard one!! Have you ever heard of ferrites having a negative effect??
(Silver is horrible to begin with) please explain, does silver get better with time, then how much time, how long and what if I were to put 50 Amps down it would that burn it in, no it would probably burn it out. Please explain the expression 'blew me away' . If your system is so clinically bad that a mains cable blew you away then I think you should re-asses life the universe and everything. If a metre of cable can 'blow you away' then there is something seriously missing. John...
(Silver is horrible to begin with) please explain, does silver get better with time, then how much time, how long and what if I were to put 50 Amps down it would that burn it in, no it would probably burn it out. Please explain the expression 'blew me away' . If your system is so clinically bad that a mains cable blew you away then I think you should re-asses life the universe and everything. If a metre of cable can 'blow you away' then there is something seriously missing. John...
Now see John. Thats EXACTLY my point that I was talking back a few posts down. You and Fred just talk down to everyone you dont agree with.
Ill answer your question but im thinking thats probably as far as THIS conversation goes as your obviously just a nasty old man whos completely stuck in his ways and with NO respect WHAT SO EVER for other people opinions........
I have tried silver mains cables, interconnects, hdmi AND speaker cables. With the exception of hdmi (Which im unsure with the construction of) ALL the cables are braided. Currently my mains is 16 core solid silver. My speaker cable is actually half solid silver half pure copper and braided (16 core) and my interconnect is 8 core solid silver.
Silver on ALL acounts starts off soundin very harsh, 'bright' and bass light. Its so incredibly obvious that im sure ANYONE could tell should they actually TRY a brand new silver cable.
It def' takes a long time to 'burn in' but under normal listening conditions (say 3 hours a day average) id say your looking around 6 months for full 'burn in' effect, but the change in the first week is by FAR the most noticeable.
BUT BUT there is a bit missing here and that is that burn in does not actually happen, there is no such thing, cables do not 'burn in' therefore if you observe that then there must be another reason, I have read about underground cables that have been there for a hundred years and they showed no difference in any way, so what characteristic of a cable change occurred during burn in?
Sorry Rik but what is it that makes you so immune from the many scams that are out there in life, after all you do seem to believe some of the 911 facts, so now look at some of the cable scam facts and particularly the burn in facts - like none.
Just get off the thread......OR........stop giving me the same answers.
Its boring, weve ALL heard it, your frightening NEW posters and its just........well.......I cant be arsed with you to be honest.
See how Bill replies? He doesnt talk down to ANYONE and when he states anything he does it in such a way as to not upset anyone. If he disagrees with someone he'll state his case and leave it (Unless asked questions). he KNOWS he doesnt need to restate his case as we ALL heard him the first time.
You and Fred?? Your both absolutely unbelievable! I heard you the FIRST 100 times John. You dont believe me. You NEVER will. I know this. I really DONT care. Jog on ffs............
If any of the 'nice' posters on here asks me politely to stop posting as its utter s**te then I will do, but it just appears to be you and Fred oddly.
I simply ask you to explain something and you get the arse, you suggest I get off the thread, yet all I've done is ask a simple question, oh and learn a little bit about punctuation, spelling and grammar but more importantly learn a little about electronics, just a tage more than nothing. Maybe take an evening class and achieve 'O' level status.
I simply ask you to explain something and you get the arse, you suggest I get off the thread, yet all I've done is ask a simple question, oh and learn a little bit about punctuation, spelling and grammar but more importantly learn a little about electronics, just a tage more than nothing. Maybe take an evening class and achieve 'O' level status.
Tell you what John
I gotta give you respect for changing the post PREVIOUS to mine
Well done sir
That really IS devious!!
NEXT time ill make SURE I quote what you said............
I have tried a few mains lead as a comparison on my system recently with a engineer. We compared them to a standard cord
The cheapest one was
Olflex classic 110SY 3G 2.5.: On my system it was the most detailed, open soundstage and made things brighter, however the downside not the smoothest, and maybe a little harsh on some systems - however a more exciting listen. (buy and make yourself $10-$12 a meter AUS, I think you can buy it in the UK)
DH Labs powerplus: bit to warm, voices were forward, mid bass solid, big sounstage but sounded a bit flat and lifeless.
Zion PE power cord: Big soundstage, neutral and balanced, solid bass, smooth - nice sounding cable, it may lack a little in sparkle
Amber studio power cord: the smoothest and sweetest, not as big soundstage as the others, lacks a little in bass.
What I preferred overall: a) on dull systems the Olflex; b) Zion most neutral; c) Amber: the most relaxed listen.
This was from an afternoon listening with a engineer friend, my wife also had a listen and she could tell the differences too. We had no agenda - we borrowed a couple of powerleads as well, approx 1.5 -2 m length plugged into a Eichmann powerboard. Each cord was less than $150 mainly around $100 AUS. We listen to the same tracks both wrote notes and both agreed with what we heard.
I am amazed, gob smacked, astounded, surprised, we are talking mains leads aren't we, so long all, I will top myself, as I seem to have learnt nothing from being in the business for forty odd years. But I'm always ready to learn something new, like the fact that film sound recording engineers got it all wrong, or the broadcasting companies missed the point, I will bow to your superior knowledge and shut up, between you all, you have told me quite squarely that I obviously have no idea about sound reproduction, I have no clue as to the science, I have no knowledge, I am a compete Luddite. I know absolutely nothing of the technology.
Sorry mate I do not crack up that easily, I do not doubt my knowledge and I will not top myself, what I will do is restate the earlier message and state catergorically that I don't believe anyone on this planet can tell one mains cable from another, unfortunatly I do not have the spare £1000 that I did, but if I did I would wager it on anyone out to prove it. But if you really feel so strongly then take it up with James Randi after all he has offered $1000,000 to anyone who can prove a difference, so if your observations are so true then simply prove them.
I am amazed, gob smacked, astounded, surprised, we are talking mains leads aren't we, so long all, I will top myself, as I seem to have learnt nothing from being in the business for forty odd years. But I'm always ready to learn something new, like the fact that film sound recording engineers got it all wrong, or the broadcasting companies missed the point, I will bow to your superior knowledge and shut up, between you all, you have told me quite squarely that I obviously have no idea about sound reproduction, I have no clue as to the science, I have no knowledge, I am a compete Luddite. I know absolutely nothing of the technology.
Sorry mate I do not crack up that easily, I do not doubt my knowledge and I will not top myself, what I will do is restate the earlier message and state catergorically that I don't believe anyone on this planet can tell one mains cable from another, unfortunatly I do not have the spare £1000 that I did, but if I did I would wager it on anyone out to prove it. But if you really feel so strongly then take it up with James Randi after all he has offered $1000,000 to anyone who can prove a difference, so if your observations are so true then simply prove them.
Randis clearly a complete w***er, much like some other people I know
"Nice to hear from you. Yes, by now we have heard about this challenge (although we were never contacted directly). Unfortunately, like most offers of $1 million this one is a hoax. While James Randi is claiming to offer a $1 million dollar prize to differentiate between these speaker cables, by reading the official rules of the challenge, it becomes immediately clear that the offer is not valid. One must be able to "demonstrate any psychic, supernatural or paranormal ability" in order to qualify. Since there is a wealth of scientific information explaining the differences between speaker cables, the offer is not a valid one (and James Randi knows it)."
".....at least one person has tried to take the "challenge" previously to show that they could differentiate between loudspeaker cables and they were denied by Randi who said "Wire is not wire. I accept that"."
Really NOT sure about that last quote but I think basically Randi can do whatever he likes!
Rik you seem to have got a reply in before me, but really 'you can tune a system' with mains cables, please define the word 'tune' and then define the word 'system', then maybe define the word 'mug', 'punter', customer', 'idiot', 'pink oboe player' who believes you. With the best will in the world John...
, and by the way you are one prolific writer my friend.... 
)
